I called it right. Joe Biden is the new president now. But Donald Trump has a lot of tricks up his sleeve.

$ The Millionaire $

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The Millionaire wrote to All <=-

I called it right. Joe Biden is the new president now.

Neither you, nor the media, have the ability to call that.


... A dry sense of humor is better than slobbering everywhere
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On 10 Nov 2020, Dr. What said the following...

The Millionaire wrote to All <=-

I called it right. Joe Biden is the new president now.

Neither you, nor the media, have the ability to call that.

I mean... you're right. you are right, The Millionairre. But... I think in the end; on January 20th... Joe Biden and his team will take the white house and Trumps refusal to concede and ... I just think is more of a reality TV show than I ever think is right for the United States of America.



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paulie420 wrote to Dr. What <=-

I mean... you're right. you are right, The Millionairre. But... I think
in the end; on January 20th... Joe Biden and his team will take the
white house and Trumps refusal to concede and ... I just think is more
of a reality TV show than I ever think is right for the United States
of America.

Trump, unlike most Republicans lately, will not concede. He will, however, accept what the law says (unlike Democrats). So expect to see Trump follow
the law and do whatever is legally possible (again, unlike Democrats) to win.

I see two outcomes here:
1. After the recounts and the removal of illegal ballots, it will become clear that Trump easily won the Electorial vote.
2. The Dems will stonewall the recounts and removal of the illegal ballots and some state votes will not be certified by the deadline. In that case, those electoral votes simply aren't counted. Neither Biden nor Trump have enough
to win and the vote goes before the, now Republican controlled, House. Again Trump will probably win.


... You CAN trust the government...ask any Indian.
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1. After the recounts and the removal of illegal ballots, it will become clearthat Trump easily won the Electorial vote.
2. The Dems will stonewall the recounts and removal of the illegal
ballots andsome state votes will not be certified by the deadline. In that case, thoseelectoral votes simply aren't counted. Neither Biden
nor Trump have enoughto win and the vote goes before the, now Republican controlled, House. AgainTrump will probably win.

3. You will see that Trump absolutely lost this vote, and should have extended all normal niceties to the incoming President of the United States.



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Hello, paulie420 -> Dr. What.
On 11/12/20 12:18 PM you wrote:

1. After the recounts and the removal of illegal ballots, it

will become DW> clearthat Trump easily won the Electorial vote. DW>
2. The Dems will stonewall the recounts and removal of the illegal

ballots andsome state votes will not be certified by the

deadline. In DW> that case, thoseelectoral votes simply aren't
counted. Neither Biden DW> nor Trump have enoughto win and the vote
goes before the, now Republican DW> controlled, House. AgainTrump
will probably win. 3. You will see that Trump absolutely lost this
vote, and should have extended all normal niceties to the incoming
President of the United States.

4. Regardless of who won, reports of irregularities, or rumored
irregularities need to be addressed.

Definitively. Not just handwaving or "fake news."

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Re: Re: Election
By: paulie420 to Dr. What on Thu Nov 12 2020 06:18 pm

1. After the recounts and the removal of illegal ballots, it will become clearthat Trump easily won the Electorial vote.
2. The Dems will stonewall the recounts and removal of the illegal
ballots andsome state votes will not be certified by the deadline. In that case, thoseelectoral votes simply aren't counted. Neither Biden
nor Trump have enoughto win and the vote goes before the, now Republican controlled, House. AgainTrump will probably win.

I'm enjoying your optimistic attitude. Keep the faith brother. Trump forever!

... Anything anybody can say about America is true.

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4. Regardless of who won, reports of irregularities, or rumored irregularities need to be addressed.

I agree with that; furthermore, I think I said so earlier, I don't think we should rely on or lean on mail-in voting on any normal election year... I do think it was needed THIS year, because of the pandemic we're all dealing with.

I'm with you that we need to sniff out ANY voting issues. I think that we've had issues, in election years passed - and this year is as good as any to decide to get on that.



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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to paulie420 on Thu Nov 12 2020 10:17 am

clear that Trump easily won the Electorial vote.
2. The Dems will stonewall the recounts and removal of the illegal ballots and some state votes will not be certified by the deadline. In that case, those electoral votes simply aren't counted. Neither Biden nor Trump have enough to win and the vote goes before the, now Republican controlled, House. Again Trump will probably win.

we can also get some faithless electors vote for trump instead of biden.
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paulie420 wrote to Dr. What <=-

3. You will see that Trump absolutely lost this vote, and should have extended all normal niceties to the incoming President of the United States.

And if that's what the courts and investigations show, then so be it.

But it will be interesting to understand how how those dead people voted and where those 160,000 Biden-only votes came from.


... It's not worth it. I'm going back to bed.
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MRO wrote to Dr. What <=-

we can also get some faithless electors vote for trump instead of
biden. ---

True.

Personally, I hope we don't see that. That would further shake trust in the election process.


... if ( original_ver == OK ) don't_upgrade();
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Charles Pierson wrote to paulie420 <=-

4. Regardless of who won, reports of irregularities, or rumored irregularities need to be addressed.

Definitively. Not just handwaving or "fake news."

I completely agree.

Regardless of who wins, I want to find out
1. How dead people voted in those numbers.
2. Why the voting machines mysteriously changed Trump votes to Biden.
3. Where the 160,000 ballots came from in my local area - in the middle of the night with only Biden selected on the ballot.

Personally, if we don't see at least some people in jail for mishandling of ballots, the trust in the election process
will be really hurt.


... Never trust a person who says, "Trust Me"....
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3. You will see that Trump absolutely lost this vote, and should have extended all normal niceties to the incoming President of the United States.

And if that's what the courts and investigations show, then so be it.

But it will be interesting to understand how how those dead people voted andwhere those 160,000 Biden-only votes came from.

I think that any court cases and investigations will show that there was an average amount of voting fraud/issues this year as any other year; Well, I think that they will show that mail-in does allow/permit for more instances and is not something we should do across the board, for every election.

I don't think theres [many] anyone saying they disagree with court cases and investigations into the issues that were present in this election - but I think whats getting louder and louder is the fact that how President Trump is handling the end of his presidency is... unethical, immoral and something thats never been done before. Team Biden should absolutely have access to all that he needs to get HIS presidency in order; Trumps huge ego and unwillingness to admit defeat and embrace the new White House is many things, but ultimately its dangerous to the US people.

Thats what he lost me over, anyway.. and I think the rest of America agreed. Pretty stupid, too - If he would have just been a tad more humble, I think a LOT of America would have given him more of a chance; maybe even another 4 years...

I hope Trump allows Biden all the tools to allow Biden to prepare.
I don't really care if Trump conceeds, however his inability to doso will completely shape my future thoughts about this guy; I supported him during his presidency- but that support is all but dead now.
I wish Trump wouldn't drag this thru the courts in the way that he is- no one but his base, and I'd be willing to bet its not a huge amount of even them, believes that he should or can retain the office.

Anyway, we disagree about some things - but ultimately I'm not saying we shouldn't investigate. I just think Trump lost - and should be more... presidential. I'm scared of thinking what he COULD do on his way out - and don't put anyting past him... its gonna be a crazy couple of months; the American people would be much better served if he'd handle them differently.



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Re: Re: Election
By: paulie420 to Dr. What on Sat Nov 14 2020 12:08:00

I think that any court cases and investigations will show that there was an average amount of voting fraud/issues this year as any other year; Well, I think that they will show that mail-in does allow/permit for more instances and is not something we should do across the board, for every election.

I don't think theres [many] anyone saying they disagree with court cases and investigations into the issues that were present in this election - but I think whats getting louder and louder is the fact that how President Trump is handling the end of his presidency is... unethical, immoral and something thats never been done before. Team Biden should absolutely have access to all that he needs to get HIS presidency in order; Trumps huge ego and unwillingness to admit defeat and embrace the new White House is many things, but ultimately its dangerous to the US people.

Thats what he lost me over, anyway.. and I think the rest of America agreed. Pretty stupid, too - If he would have just been a tad more humble, I think a LOT of America would have given him more of a chance; maybe even another 4 years...

I hope Trump allows Biden all the tools to allow Biden to prepare.
I don't really care if Trump conceeds, however his inability to doso will completely shape my future thoughts about this guy; I supported him during his presidency- but that support is all but dead now.
I wish Trump wouldn't drag this thru the courts in the way that he is- no one but his base, and I'd be willing to bet its not a huge amount of even them, believes that he should or can retain the office.

Anyway, we disagree about some things - but ultimately I'm not saying we shouldn't investigate. I just think Trump lost - and should be more... presidential. I'm scared of thinking what he COULD do on his way out - and don't put anyting past him... its gonna be a crazy couple of months; the American people would be much better served if he'd handle them differently.

Normally, I would agree with you, an think Trump is behaving awfully. If the Democrats/Establishment were not so hellbent on revenge, on putting people into line, there would be no excuse for Trumps action.

But given that Trump would be handing power to people, who in my view, are acting like FASCISTS, Trump is defending many millions of Americans from being left to the dogs. If the Democrats, the media, the establishment was acting in good faith, I would say Trumps action are indefensible. But these people are not acting like that, they are enabling a new theocracy, Communist style politics and some really scary ideas and sensorship. Trump owes it to the USA to ensure that these people cannot engage in further dodgy actions (as they have been doing so far), and being a stickler for election legitimacy is a good way to do it.

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But it will be interesting to understand how how those dead people voted and where those 160,000 Biden-only votes came from.

While that does seem like an awfully high amount, I am not at all surprised that some people only vote in the Presidential race.


* SLMR 2.1a * WOW!... Short runway...but look how WIDE it is!!!

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I think that any court cases and investigations will show that there was an ave
age amount of voting fraud/issues this year as any other year; Well, I think th
t they will show that mail-in does allow/permit for more instances and is not s
mething we should do across the board, for every election.

I mostly agree, although this thing with Dominion is becoming interesting.
I am curious to see if it turns out to be accidental or on purpose. They
will probably never be able to prove it was the latter, granted.

ts getting louder and louder is the fact that how President Trump is handling t
e end of his presidency is... unethical, immoral and something thats never been
done before. Team Biden should absolutely have access to all that he needs to g
t HIS presidency in order; Trumps huge ego and unwillingness to admit defeat an
embrace the new White House is many things, but ultimately its dangerous to the
US people.

My understanding of the election process is that Biden, as the Democratic
party nominee, already has/had access to a lot of the things they need. Particularly, I have heard it mentioned in the press that he is being
denied access to security briefings. As the nominee, I think he already
had access to those. I think I learned that fact during the last
election cycle when some partisans got upset when the found out that Trump
(or HRC, for the other side) had already been briefed so that they could formulate their campaign.

Anyway, we disagree about some things - but ultimately I'm not saying we should
't investigate. I just think Trump lost - and should be more... presidential. I
m scared of thinking what he COULD do on his way out - and don't put anyting pa
t him... its gonna be a crazy couple of months; the American people would be mu
h better served if he'd handle them differently.

I also agree he lost, provided this Dominion thing doesn't grow any bigger
than it already has. I think some people are concerned, me included, that whatever might have happened there will get swept under the rug if it waits until Biden takes office. Allowing an apparently incompetent software
company to continue to be involved in our election process is a concern to
me.


* SLMR 2.1a * !enilgat cinataS !eraweB ­

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paulie420 wrote to Dr. What <=-

election - but I think whats getting louder and louder is the fact that how President Trump is handling the end of his presidency is...
unethical, immoral and something thats never been done before.

False Leftie Narrative.

There are enough electoral votes that are disputed that Biden's "win" is just propaganda.

Lefties like to ignore any law that they don't like (which is any that doesn't go along with their Narrative). The media doesn't get to call the election - that's the law. And "never been done before" is just smoke.

Team
Biden should absolutely have access to all that he needs to get HIS presidency in order;

And he will, once he's won, which won't happen until Dec. 12 at the earliest. And seeing how the Biden family itself is a huge security risk, I can't see senile Joe getting access until he's officially won (if ever).

Trumps huge ego and unwillingness to admit defeat
and embrace the new White House is many things, but ultimately its dangerous to the US people.

More False Leftie Narrative.

Thats what he lost me over, anyway.. and I think the rest of America agreed. Pretty stupid, too - If he would have just been a tad more
humble, I think a LOT of America would have given him more of a chance; maybe even another 4 years...

Based on the amount of red on the maps, most of America did give Trump another 4 years. The "blue wave" that was predicted never happened.

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Dumas Walker wrote to DR. WHAT <=-

But it will be interesting to understand how how those dead people voted and where those 160,000 Biden-only votes came from.

While that does seem like an awfully high amount, I am not at all surprised that some people only vote in the Presidential race.

I would agree with the "some". But 160,000 of Biden-only votes. That's
a big red flag.

Yes, some percent will vote for only the presidental choice - but not 160,000 in one shot. And even then, out of a 160,000 votes the chance that 0 will be for someone other than Biden is highly improbable (along the chances of winning the lottery).


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Yes, some percent will vote for only the presidental choice - but not 160,000 >in one shot. And even then, out of a 160,000 votes the chance that 0 will be >for someone other than Biden is highly improbable (along the chances of winning
the lottery).

Agreed. Watching the results, when they suddenly jumped like that, made we wonder if some states were couting their votes in batches of who the person voted for. The only way I can figure it would work that way would be if
they sorted them by Presidential vote first before counting. However, as
all of the votes until then were not for Trump, that wasn't exactly what
they were doing.


* SLMR 2.1a * Explosion at the Mint. Change in staff.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to paulie420 on Mon Nov 16 2020 10:08 am

Based on the amount of red on the maps, most of America did give Trump another
4 years. The "blue wave" that was predicted never happened.

The map does look pretty red, but then you remember that excluding the red-turning-purple Lone Star State, several million more people live in blue California than all those reliably red states west of the Mississippi River combined. Those 14 Republican-leaning states get to cast 72 electoral college votes to California's 55, but it's a lot of land colored red on that map for not a lot of people.

It's not really a close election at all. Trump has lost by more than 5 million votes and he'll still have lost by 5 million votes when it's all certified in December. It's not close in the Electoral College either despite the built-in advantage the GOP currently holds in our antiquated system for chosing presidents. It's perplexing that more than 70 million voted to keep an egomaniacal, compulsive liar and con man in power, but so many more voted to remove him.

Trump told us he'd never accept defeat. We knew he'd declare victory before all the votes were counted if he held an early lead on election night.

Trump is going to do what serves Trump; American be damned. So let him golf and tweet absurdities in all caps while his lawyers soak MAGA donors for millions. The hope is he can't do more harm now than he's done in four years. He never puts much effort into anything and he's not about to start. We'll have to pick up the pieces from his laziness and incompetency, but he'll be gone in a couple months. Still an annoyance and an embarassment for sure, but no longer posing a direct threat to national and global security.

D-Gen

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Trump is going to do what serves Trump; American be damned.

Which makes him different than Biden or HRC or Obama or W or any other
recent President, except maybe the elder Bush, how?


* SLMR 2.1a * I shook my family tree and a bunch of nuts fell out.

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D-Generate wrote to Dr. What <=-

The map does look pretty red, but then you remember that excluding the red-turning-purple Lone Star State, several million more people live in blue California than all those reliably red states west of the
Mississippi River combined.

And I'll remind you that we live in a republic, not a democracy.

The Electoral process was set up so that whoever gets the Presidency is the one who gets the most wide-spread support - not the one who get the popular vote.

Based on the red on the map, Trump got the most wide-spread support. Biden only got support from small areas.

It's not really a close election at all.

Then you need to watch something other than CNN for your "news". Last I checked
Trump was slightly ahead in electoral votes with nearly all the swing states still in play.

Trump told us he'd never accept defeat. We knew he'd declare victory before all the votes were counted if he held an early lead on election night.

No. You were told by your Leftie handlers all that.

Trump is going to do what serves Trump; American be damned.

You're confused. That's the attitude of Biden and the rest of the lefties - as they've demonstrated time and time again. But you'll only know that if
you get your information from non-propaganda sources.


... Polls show that 9 out of 6 schizophrenics agree.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to paulie420 on Mon Nov 16 2020 10:08 am

Based on the amount of red on the maps, most of America did give Trump another 4 years. The "blue wave" that was predicted never happened.

Land doesn't vote. People do.

DaiTengu

... Everyone has his day, and some days last longer than others.

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On 11/12/2020 11:18 AM, paulie420 wrote:

3. You will see that Trump absolutely lost this vote, and
should have extended all normal niceties to the incoming
President of the United States.

You mean like the niceties extended to Trump?
(See Flynn prosecution, Russiagate and Impeachment).

--
Michael J. Ryan
tracker1 +o Roughneck BBS

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Re: Re: Election
By: Tracker1 to paulie420 on Wed Nov 18 2020 03:45 pm

You mean like the niceties extended to Trump?
(See Flynn prosecution, Russiagate and Impeachment).

Flynn admitted his guilt. Twice.

Rissiagate? Several were investigated, convicted and imprisoned.

Yes, Donald Trump was impeached. It's too bad he wasn't removed from office then but republicans were not interested in justice.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Admit Nothing..... Deny EVERYTHING..... Demand PROOF!

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to D-Generate on Wed Nov 18 2020 08:50 am

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Based on the amount of red on the maps, most of America did give Trump another 4 years. The "blue wave" that was predicted never happened.

Land doesn't vote. People do.

Neither vote for President. The states do via the electoral college.


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On 11/17/2020 3:27 PM, Dumas Walker wrote:

Trump is going to do what serves Trump; American be damned.

Which makes him different than Biden or HRC or Obama or W or any other
recent President, except maybe the elder Bush, how?

I do think Trump is probably better in that regard since at least Bush
41. I do think that Reagan absolutely was about country first, loved
the US, western culture and democracy, and it showed. HW served the
country above most other things, but his family was highly political
beyond him though.

Clinton, I don't even know where to begin, and Obama largely emulated
the same. Biden is probably the absolute worst in terms of corruption
of the political system of any President in the past century. I wish it
were different.

I'm hoping to see more from the likes of Crenshaw and other more
populist conservative upstarts in the mid-terms and 2024 election run.
I'd also like to see a more pragmatic Libertarian candidate running, but that's a really hard ask.

The Marxists inside the DNC need to be stopped in their tracks and the
tech censorship worries me in so much as their ideas may spread
unchecked by reality, history or experience of those who know better.

--
Michael J. Ryan
tracker1 +o Roughneck BBS

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On 11/18/2020 10:03 PM, Al wrote:

You mean like the niceties extended to Trump?
(See Flynn prosecution, Russiagate and Impeachment).

Flynn admitted his guilt. Twice.

Flynn admitted to misstating things... and the prosecution was malicious
with intervention from inside the Whitehouse, politically motivated.
The FBI was ready to drop things. They were also threatening to
persecute his son.

Beyond this, he didn't do anything that Biden's staff isn't doing right
now, so should they all be locked up as well?

Rissiagate? Several were investigated, convicted and imprisoned.

Yes... but Trump wasn't involved in anything. Also, regarding some of
those investigations, they weren't directly related.

Yes, Donald Trump was impeached. It's too bad he wasn't removed from
office then but republicans were not interested in justice.

Maybe the Congress should have followed through and actually gone to the Supreme Court to call on the witnesses that refused to show up? They
didn't and the Senate was under no requirement to do so, it lost on its'
own (lack of) merit.

Beyond this, later released notes from inside the (closed) committee
hearings shows that most of what was talked about on the news outlets
was made up and without evidence despite statements like, "we have proof!"

--
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Re: Re: Election
By: Tracker1 to Al on Thu Nov 19 2020 01:57 pm

Flynn admitted to misstating things... and the prosecution was malicious with intervention from inside the Whitehouse, politically motivated.
The FBI was ready to drop things. They were also threatening to
persecute his son.

Flynn admitted to lying to the FBI about conversations he had with Russia's embassador to the US. He said he pleaded guilty because he lied. His son also had some kind of entanglement but I don't know if that was related to Flynn's charges.

Roger Stone was also convicted and about to go to jail to serve his time when Donald Trump commuted his sentence.

Beyond this, he didn't do anything that Biden's staff isn't doing right now, so should they all be locked up as well?

What has Biden's staff done? Biden won an election that is said to be "free and fair" and one of the most secure elections. Today people get fired for saying things like that. Strange.

Rissiagate? Several were investigated, convicted and imprisoned.

Yes... but Trump wasn't involved in anything. Also, regarding some of those investigations, they weren't directly related.

Trump wasn't involved? He was impeached!

When asked Mueller said that Trump could be charged with obstruction after he left office. The Mueller report never cleared Trump as William Barr said.

Maybe the Congress should have followed through and actually gone to the Supreme Court to call on the witnesses that refused to show up? They didn't and the Senate was under no requirement to do so, it lost on its' own (lack of) merit.

There was no trial to speak of because republicans didn't want one, the facts be damned.

Perhaps if there was there could have been some kind of closure, guilty or not.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... I strive for perfection, what I get is reality.

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DaiTengu wrote to Dr. What <=-

Land doesn't vote. People do.

And I'll remind you that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

Lefties like to ignore the facts that they don't like. The fact is that
the Constutition set up a system where the President is the candidate that
gets the most wide-spread support.

If you look at the maps, you will see that Biden got only a few, hightly populated areas of the country. Even here in Michigan, he got only the
large cities. Not what I would call "wide-spread" support.


... Take no prisoners, we can't feed them.
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Al wrote to Tracker1 <=-

Flynn admitted his guilt. Twice.

Flynn admitted that he did things.

BTW: Biden just did those same things. I don't see Biden getting arrested
for violating the Logan Act.

Yes, Donald Trump was impeached. It's too bad he wasn't removed from office then but republicans were not interested in justice.

Neither were the Democrats. They are just interested in power.


... I am in total control, but don't tell my wife.
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Al wrote to Tracker1 <=-

What has Biden's staff done? Biden won an election that is said to be "free and fair" and one of the most secure elections. Today people get fired for saying things like that. Strange.

If you think that Biden won, you need to stop watching CNN.

The decision won't be made until Dec. 12 when the Electoral College votes.

Lefties like to ignore facts that they don't like.


... Do NOT look into laser with remaining eye..
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Fri Nov 20 2020 10:12 am

If you think Trump is going to win when the Electoral College casts its votes and if you think everyone who isn't on board with MAGA is glued to CNN, you should take your own advice and deversify your news consumption. ONN, Newsmax, Breitbart and the dwindling number of Trump-approved outlets are Trumpworld favorites for a reason and it's not because of high journalism standards or a track record of crediblity. Note how Fox News has fallen out of favor for "disloyalty." Perhaps try the Wall Street Journal, Reason.com, and something from the foreign press like, say, the Economist? Reading points of view that challenge one's own world view is a habit I would encourage for all regardless of political allegiance.

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Dr. What wrote to DaiTengu <=-

DaiTengu wrote to Dr. What <=-

Land doesn't vote. People do.

And I'll remind you that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

Lefties like to ignore the facts that they don't like. The fact is
that the Constutition set up a system where the President is the
candidate that gets the most wide-spread support.

If you look at the maps, you will see that Biden got only a few,
hightly populated areas of the country. Even here in Michigan, he got only the large cities. Not what I would call "wide-spread" support.

Having an election decided SOLELY by the number of nationwide votes is a
bad idea. The US system wasn't an issue until Trump got elected, then
people decided a system which worked for two centuries was faulty, and
they "forgot" why its set up the way it is. Australians said the
Electoral College system was crazy, seemingly unaware that we aren't all
that different!

In Australia, the ruling party is decided by the members of the house of representatives. The country is divided up into a fixed number of
electorates, each electorate covers a region encompassing a set number
of people. So each electorate has the same number of people, but
obviously will vary in size depending on density. The electorate votes
for who will take a set in the house of representatives, and the representatives basically determine the winning party. The Senate
(upper house) represents the states evenly. So it is quite possible for
one party to get more votes, but win less seats overall. You want to
represent not just the most people, but the broadest area.

It seems the Democrats do NOT have wide support. It makes sense, if
most of the regions of the US support Trump, that this would weigh in
his favour.


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Re: Re: Election
By: D-Generate to Dr. What on Fri Nov 20 2020 09:40 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Fri Nov 20 2020 10:12 am

If you think Trump is going to win when the Electoral College casts its votes and if you think everyone who isn't on board with MAGA is glued to

he could win by faithless electors. if the state i represented had voter fraud i would consider it if i was an elector.
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Trump is going to do what serves Trump; American be damned.

Which makes him different than Biden or HRC or Obama or W or any other recent President, except maybe the elder Bush, how?

I do think Trump is probably better in that regard since at least Bush
41. I do think that Reagan absolutely was about country first, loved
the US, western culture and democracy, and it showed. HW served the
country above most other things, but his family was highly political
beyond him though.

I also do. If Trump was all about himself he would be getting paid to be President, for one. I believe that his methods were too rough. If they
were more polished, he would have had a better time of it (but maybe would
not have been elected to begin with!). I feel that Regan and GHW Bush both loved their country. Not sure that W didn't, either, but he was at least surrounded by profiteers.

Clinton, I don't even know where to begin, and Obama largely emulated
the same. Biden is probably the absolute worst in terms of corruption
of the political system of any President in the past century. I wish it
were different.

IMHO, Obama disliked the country more that Bill did. Not completely sure
Bill disliked it so much as I did not always agree with his methods, and he
was out to make a buck I am sure. He at least liked the female US
population a lot. HRC disliked most of the country. Biden is a corruption machine.

I'm hoping to see more from the likes of Crenshaw and other more
populist conservative upstarts in the mid-terms and 2024 election run.
I'd also like to see a more pragmatic Libertarian candidate running, but that's a really hard ask.

I like Ben Carson. He was my 2016 pick but never really got enough backing
to make a solid go in the primaries.

The Marxists inside the DNC need to be stopped in their tracks and the
tech censorship worries me in so much as their ideas may spread
unchecked by reality, history or experience of those who know better.

So far anyway, Biden seems to maybe be ignoring the "more progressive"
members of his party. Not sure what will happen when he is forced to step aside and Harris takes over.


* SLMR 2.1a * Oxymoron: Plastic Silverware.

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What has Biden's staff done?

Biden himself has admitted, in past, that he withheld US funding to the
Ukraine until they fired a prosecutor. What he left out of his admission
was that this same prosecutor was busy going after the company his son was working for.

https://youtu.be/UXA--dj2-CY


* SLMR 2.1a * Oh, I see, said the blind man to his deaf wife

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Sat Nov 21 2020 11:31 am

Biden himself has admitted, in past, that he withheld US funding to the Ukraine until they fired a prosecutor. What he left out of his admission was that this same prosecutor was busy going after the company his son was working for.

This investigation is complete and Biden did nothing wrong. It wasn't Biden who wanted the prosecutor fired, it was for some policy or corruption on the part of that prosecutor and he was fired.

It's true Biden's son had a contract with Barisma, a big fat juicy one but there is nothing wrong with that.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... The large print giveth and the small print taketh away.

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D-Generate wrote to Dr. What <=-

If you think Trump is going to win when the Electoral College casts its votes and if you think everyone who isn't on board with MAGA is glued
to CNN, you should take your own advice and deversify your news consumption. ONN, Newsmax, Breitbart and the dwindling number of Trump-approved outlets are Trumpworld favorites for a reason and it's
not because of high journalism standards or a track record of
crediblity. Note how Fox News has fallen out of favor for "disloyalty."

*Laugh* You really need to get a dose of reality. CNN and the other "news" networks are failing because they stopped
being journalists and became pushers of propaganda. Fox, which was simply less, is failing not because of "disloyality"
but because they dropped what little journalism they were doing to join the propagandists.

It's all about being trustworthy. Pushing a false leftie narrative against the facts makes people not trust you and Fox
is paying the price for that.


... To test a man's character, give him power.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
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Al wrote to Dumas Walker <=-

This investigation is complete and Biden did nothing wrong. It wasn't Biden who wanted the prosecutor fired, it was for some policy or corruption on the part of that prosecutor and he was fired.

So, the video and audio of Biden saying that Ukrain wasn't going to get Federal money unless the prosecutor was fired is false? Someone made it up and Biden really didn't say those things?

You honestly expect anyone to believe that Leftie narrative?


... To get a loan you must prove you don't need it.
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þ Synchronet þ Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA

Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to D-Generate on Sun Nov 22 2020 11:59 am

*Laugh* You really need to get a dose of reality. CNN and the other "news" networks are failing because they stopped
being journalists and became pushers of propaganda. Fox, which was simply less, is failing not because of "disloyality"

I think it's great Trump refuses to answer any questions from the Press. Pay back's a bitch. F*^ck all of them.

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Re: Re: Election
By: HusTler to Dr. What on Sun Nov 22 2020 04:41 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to D-Generate on Sun Nov 22 2020 11:59 am

*Laugh* You really need to get a dose of reality. CNN and the other
"news" networks are failing because they stopped
being journalists and became pushers of propaganda. Fox, which was
simply less, is failing not because of "disloyality"

I think it's great Trump refuses to answer any questions from the Press. Pay back's a bitch. F*^ck all of them.

he should just call them in and say "fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, and kick them out one by one"

did you see that yahoo news talked about jr's corona virus and referred to the president as former reality show host
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Sun Nov 22 2020 12:19 pm

So, the video and audio of Biden saying that Ukrain wasn't going to get Federal money unless the prosecutor was fired is false? Someone made it up and Biden really didn't say those things?

Well yes he did if I remember right that is what he said. This is an old thing you speak of from when Biden was vice president. It was the American position that they wanted the despot removed and he was.

What Donald Trump was doing was a little different. Donald was holding money congress gave Ukraine for dirt on Biden. That was not never the American position.

Donald Trump does not care about you or America. He only cares about himself.

You honestly expect anyone to believe that Leftie narrative?

I am not a leftie or righty or a democrat or a republican. I am a conservative if that really matters but I have a problem with several "facts" around all this.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Does the National Ballet travel by Tu Tu Train?

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Re: Re: Election
By: HusTler to Dr. What on Sun Nov 22 2020 04:41 pm

I think it's great Trump refuses to answer any questions from the Press. Pay back's a bitch. F*^ck all of them.

Trump loves the spotlight. If he had an answer he'd be there with bells on.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Luxuriantly hand-crafted from only the finest ASCII.

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Al wrote to Dr. What <=-

You honestly expect anyone to believe that Leftie narrative?

I am not a leftie or righty or a democrat or a republican. I am a conservative if that really matters but I have a problem with
several "facts" around all this.

LOL! HAR!!!!

There's the best joke you'll read all day!

Actually, it's complete bullshit. You're about as Left as it gets,
who do you think you're kidding?


... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Al on Mon Nov 23 2020 08:01 am

LOL! HAR!!!!

There's the best joke you'll read all day!

Glad I could make you laugh.

Actually, it's complete bullshit. You're about as Left as it gets,
who do you think you're kidding?

I am a conservative, I have conservative values although I admit I am progressive. I believe in science.

This Donald Trump thing is not conservatism. It is something else.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... COMMAND: A suggestion made to a computer.

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þ Synchronet þ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada

So, the video and audio of Biden saying that Ukrain wasn't going to get >DW> Federal money unless the prosecutor was fired is false? Someone made it up >DW> and Biden really didn't say those things?

Well yes he did if I remember right that is what he said. This is an old thing >ou speak of from when Biden was vice president. It was the American position th
t they wanted the despot removed and he was.

What Donald Trump was doing was a little different. Donald was holding money co
gress gave Ukraine for dirt on Biden. That was not never the American position.

My understanding is that no one in Washington is allowed to withhold
promised foreign aid money regardless of the reason. Biden withholding
until they fire an attorney (who was after his son's company) or Trump's
team withholding it hoping to get the country to pursue a case against
Biden (for doing the same thing) is not different under those circumstances.


* SLMR 2.1a * "Mmmmmmmm.....pie pants."

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Al wrote to Dr. What <=-

You honestly expect anyone to believe that Leftie narrative?

I am not a leftie or righty or a democrat or a republican. I am a conservative if that really matters but I have a problem with
several "facts" around all this.

LOL! HAR!!!!

There's the best joke you'll read all day!

Actually, it's complete bullshit. You're about as Left as it gets,
who do you think you're kidding?

You have to remember, on the West Coast, conservative is a little farther left than it is in the rest of the country. In Canada, it is farther left still.
On the West Coast of Canada, it is quite likely somewhere to the left of center.

#

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Al wrote to Dr. What <=-

Well yes he did if I remember right that is what he said. This is an
old thing you speak of from when Biden was vice president. It was the American position that they wanted the despot removed and he was.

You don't remember right. You should review the video again.

It was pretty clear that Quid Pro Joe wanted the prosecutor (that was investigating the company his worthless son was on the board of) removed
or the gov't of Ukraine wouldn't get the money.

There was no "despot" involved. But nice attempt at a spin.

What Donald Trump was doing was a little different. Donald was holding money congress gave Ukraine for dirt on Biden. That was not never the American position.

Just more fake news from the Leftie media.

Donald Trump does not care about you or America. He only cares about himself.

You're confused. Biden has been in politics for 47 years without doing anything. The Dems have a trail of corruption so long that it's almost horrorifying. Of course, you won't see any of that as long as you continue
to watch your Leftie Media.

I am not a leftie or righty or a democrat or a republican. I am a conservative if that really matters but I have a problem with several "facts" around all this.

You keep spouting Leftie talking points and ignoring the facts.

You are a Leftie.


... Scaldophobia: Fear the toilet will flush while showering.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
þ Synchronet þ Diamond Mine Online BBS - bbs.dmine.net:24 - Fredericksburg, VA USA

Al wrote to Gamgee <=-

I am a conservative, I have conservative values although I admit I am progressive. I believe in science.

Science isn't a "belief". You are spewing Leftie nonsence again and showing that you are a Leftie.

It's getting easy to spot lefties:
1. Complete lack of self-awareness.
2. Narcissism.
3. Inability to accept reality.

This Donald Trump thing is not conservatism. It is something else.

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone in so
long that it's hard to recognize.


... I'm not afraid of heights; I'm afraid of widths.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Mon Nov 23 2020 05:03 pm

My understanding is that no one in Washington is allowed to withhold promised foreign aid money regardless of the reason. Biden withholding until they fire an attorney (who was after his son's company)

It was the American position that they wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was fired.

or Trump's team withholding it hoping to get the country to pursue a case against Biden (for doing the same thing) is not different under those circumstances.

Trump was not acting from the American position. Congress gave this aid to Ukraine but Trump didn't give it to them. He held it up until they agreed to dig up dirt on biden, his political opponent.

A very different scenario.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... All real programs contain errors.

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Dumas Walker wrote to Gamgee <=-

I am not a leftie or righty or a democrat or a republican. I am a conservative if that really matters but I have a problem with
several "facts" around all this.

LOL! HAR!!!!

There's the best joke you'll read all day!

Actually, it's complete bullshit. You're about as Left as it gets,
who do you think you're kidding?

You have to remember, on the West Coast, conservative is a little
farther left than it is in the rest of the country. In Canada,
it is farther left still. On the West Coast of Canada, it is
quite likely somewhere to the left of center.

Good points, thanks.

I would add, though, that what actually matters to a person who is
evaluating another's political standing is the perspective of *THAT*
*PERSON* (in this example, me). I consider myself a conservative,
right of center but not in the extreme, and to *ME*, this other person
is very far to the left on "my" scale.



... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:06 am

You don't remember right. You should review the video again.

It was pretty clear that Quid Pro Joe wanted the prosecutor (that was investigating the company his worthless son was on the board of) removed or the gov't of Ukraine wouldn't get the money.

Yeah. That's what I said.

There was no "despot" involved. But nice attempt at a spin.

They wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was.

What Donald Trump was doing was a little different. Donald was
holding money congress gave Ukraine for dirt on Biden. That was not
never the American position.

Just more fake news from the Leftie media.

That is what Donald Trump was doing. That is largely what got him impeached.

Donald Trump does not care about you or America. He only cares about
himself.

You're confused. Biden has been in politics for 47 years without doing anything. The Dems have a trail of corruption so long that it's almost horrorifying. Of course, you won't see any of that as long as you continue to watch your Leftie Media.

Your right, Biden has been in politics for decades. He was vice president for eight years beside a very successful president. The people knew what they were getting with Biden.

You keep spouting Leftie talking points and ignoring the facts.

I have the facts in hand. The facts don't show any of the right's claims as having any basis in reality. Fantasy maybe, but not reality.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Reality is for those who can't handle computers.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:13 am

This Donald Trump thing is not conservatism. It is something else.

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone in so long that it's hard to recognize.

Wasn't he a democrat at one time? Donald Trump is what sells.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... My modem isn't slow- it's "baudily challenged!"

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:13 am

It's getting easy to spot lefties:
1. Complete lack of self-awareness.
2. Narcissism.
3. Inability to accept reality.

Interesting...

---TLM

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My understanding is that no one in Washington is allowed to withhold promised foreign aid money regardless of the reason. Biden withholding until they fire an attorney (who was after his son's company)

It was the American position that they wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and h
was fired.

Yes, and the US government is not allowed to withhold promised foreign aid
for quid-pro-quo favors. So, are you saying that Obama and Biden are
guilty?

Trump was not acting from the American position. Congress gave this aid to Ukra
ne but Trump didn't give it to them. He held it up until they agreed to dig up >irt on biden, his political opponent.

A very different scenario.

No as neither are legal. You seem to keep missing that point. You can't
seem to get around "Biden is D and D is gud."


* SLMR 2.1a * Make BC Great Again! Trump for Premier!!!!

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Good points, thanks.

I would add, though, that what actually matters to a person who is
evaluating another's political standing is the perspective of *THAT*
*PERSON* (in this example, me). I consider myself a conservative,
right of center but not in the extreme, and to *ME*, this other person
is very far to the left on "my" scale.

He is just far enough left that he apparently doesn't believe in burning
down cities. Any farther left and he would. That is my perspective.

For him, any American politician who has a (D) after their name always tells the truth and shouldn't be questioned. That is all you need to know.


* SLMR 2.1a * Tell me, is something eluding you, Sunshine?

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Well yes he did if I remember right that is what he said. This is an
old thing you speak of from when Biden was vice president. It was the American position that they wanted the despot removed and he was.

You don't remember right. You should review the video again.

It was pretty clear that Quid Pro Joe wanted the prosecutor (that was investigating the company his worthless son was on the board of) removed
or the gov't of Ukraine wouldn't get the money.

There was no "despot" involved. But nice attempt at a spin.

If Al was a football replay official, he'd have to know whether the player
who might have comitted targeting was a Democrat or a Republican before making his call. Seeing it clearly on video would not be enough.


* SLMR 2.1a * Tell me, is something eluding you, Sunshine?

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It was pretty clear that Quid Pro Joe wanted the prosecutor (that was investigating the company his worthless son was on the board of) removed or the gov't of Ukraine wouldn't get the money.

Yeah. That's what I said.

There was no "despot" involved. But nice attempt at a spin.

They wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was.

It is illegal for the US government to withhold promised foreign aid funds while asking for something in return. So, "they wanted a corrupt
prosecutor fired, and he was," = they did something illegal.

Do they not teach you what quid pro quo means in Canada?

That is what Donald Trump was doing. That is largely what got him impeached.

And it was illegal when Biden, or Obama, did it, too.

The people knew what they were getting with Biden.

Someone who isn't the Orange Bad Man. Also, someone in cognative decline who will eventually give way to his leftist VP pick. Some knew that, too, and thought it was fine, but I can guarantee not all of them will think so.


* SLMR 2.1a * Make BC Great Again! Trump for Premier!!!!

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This Donald Trump thing is not conservatism. It is something else.

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone in so long that it's hard to recognize.

Wasn't he a democrat at one time? Donald Trump is what sells.

Most democrats who are also conservatives are now republicans, or at least
vote for them for President. For a Canadian who supposedly knows more
about American politics, and what is good for us, than we do I am surprised
you were not aware of that.


* SLMR 2.1a * Make BC Great Again! Trump for Premier!!!!

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:06 am


Aren't you just repeating sh*t Don said?

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Tue Nov 24 2020 05:57 pm

This Donald Trump thing is not conservatism. It is something
else.

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone
in so
long that it's hard to recognize.

Wasn't he a democrat at one time? Donald Trump is what sells.

Most democrats who are also conservatives are now republicans, or at least vote for them for President. For a Canadian who supposedly knows more about American politics, and what is good for us, than we do I am surprised you were not aware of that.

he doesnt know shit. it's hillarious someone that is canadian is so obsessed with donald trump. they got bigger problems over there.

donald is old school democrat. the current democrats are fucking distructive and dont care about the people.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Tue Nov 24 2020 05:28 pm

Yes, and the US government is not allowed to withhold promised foreign aid for quid-pro-quo favors. So, are you saying that Obama and Biden are guilty?

The issue is not the foreign aid.

The issue is that Trump held up the aid for dirt on his political opponent.

Did Biden ever do that?

No as neither are legal. You seem to keep missing that point. You can't seem to get around "Biden is D and D is gud."

I never said D is gud. A D can be just as stinky as an R if they choose to be.

A democrat, republican or any politician who does corrupt things should be called out and charged if their actions are criminal.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... You! What PLANET is this? McCoy, stardate 3134.0.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Tue Nov 24 2020 05:57 pm

Wasn't he a democrat at one time? Donald Trump is what sells.

Most democrats who are also conservatives are now republicans, or at least vote for them for President.

OK, thanks for the explanation. ;)

Ttyl :-),
Al

... If you think education is expensive, try ignorance.

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Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

Good points, thanks.

I would add, though, that what actually matters to a person who is evaluating another's political standing is the perspective of *THAT* *PERSON* (in this example, me). I consider myself a conservative,
right of center but not in the extreme, and to *ME*, this other person
is very far to the left on "my" scale.

He is just far enough left that he apparently doesn't believe in
burning down cities. Any farther left and he would. That is my perspective.

For him, any American politician who has a (D) after their name
always tells the truth and shouldn't be questioned. That is all
you need to know.

Yes, and of course (for him) any politician with an (R) after their
name does nothing but lie. Always and forever. Especially if he is
the President.



... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:13 am

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone in so
long that it's hard to recognize.

Trump's ideological views are Conservative. His biggest problem though is that he believes in big government and has expanded it since taking office. Contrary to what he said he was going to do, he did not shrink government but has instead added 2 million jobs to the federal workforce.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Dumas Walker on Tue Nov 24 2020 07:56 am

I would add, though, that what actually matters to a person who is evaluating another's political standing is the perspective of *THAT* *PERSON* (in this example, me). I consider myself a conservative,
right of center but not in the extreme, and to *ME*, this other person
is very far to the left on "my" scale.

This has happened in the UK also. These days a "conservative" is someone who is left of centre, compared to say... 15-20 years ago when they would have been referred to as a "leftie". Now the smaller parties that are occupying the right of centre are deemed to comprise of "The Far Right". This effect is known as the Overton window.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Dr. What on Wed Nov 25 2020 09:53 am

Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Tue Nov 24 2020 08:13 am

Trump is a Conservative. But we haven't seen one with a backbone in
so long that it's hard to recognize.

Trump's ideological views are Conservative. His biggest problem though is that he believes in big government and has expanded it since taking office. Contrary to what he said he was going to do, he did not shrink government but has instead added 2 million jobs to the federal workforce.

oh god trump made 2 million jobs. he is literally hitler
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Re: Re: Election
By: MRO to Andeddu on Wed Nov 25 2020 02:44 pm

Trump's ideological views are Conservative. His biggest problem though is that he believes in big government and has expanded it since taking office. Contrary to what he said he was going to do, he did not shrink government but has instead added 2 million jobs to the federal workforce.

oh god trump made 2 million jobs. he is literally hitler

Public sector jobs are not "real" jobs though. Any president could employ their entire nation and have 0% unemployment, but that would crash the economy. A true Conservative belives in private ownership and Capitalism as an economic system, and that includes having a SMALL government.

He is more of an old school Democrat, the sort you'd find in the 70s-80s.

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Al wrote to Dr. What <=-

They wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was.

They wanted a prosecutor who was going after the corrupt company Hunter Biden was on the board off.

Big difference there.

That is what Donald Trump was doing. That is largely what got him impeached.

*Yawn* Ya, a big nothing-burger from the Dems wasting all that time and money on their political games.

Your right, Biden has been in politics for decades. He was vice
president for eight years beside a very successful president. The
people knew what they were getting with Biden.

Ya, more corruption, which is all the Osama... er.. Obama administration gave us.

I have the facts in hand. The facts don't show any of the right's
claims as having any basis in reality. Fantasy maybe, but not reality.

All you have is Leftie talking points. But for Lefties, the Narrative is reality. That's why Lefties are so mad and sad all the time: Reality won't go along with their Narrative.



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Andeddu wrote to Dr. What <=-

Trump's ideological views are Conservative. His biggest problem though
is that he believes in big government and has expanded it since taking office. Contrary to what he said he was going to do, he did not shrink government but has instead added 2 million jobs to the federal
workforce.

I just love the way Lefties want to change the definition to match their "facts".

"Big Government" has to do with the intrusion of government into our lives.

I will point to the Preamble to the Constutition:
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

So, let's see, the Dems:
1. Allowed people to riot and destroy cities - so they failed on domestic tranquility.
2. Are in league with China and Russia - so they failed on common defense.
3. Promote social programs that keep people in poverty - so they fail on general welfare.
4. Want to tell us how to live our lives - so they fail on the Blessings of Liberty.

while Trump:
1. Deputized local law enforcement as federal agents which help to squash the riots.
2. Is pulling out of bad foreign deals, foreign wars and is brokering peace - sounds to me like it's providing for common defence.
3. Removing rules, regulations, programs that keep people down. The last 4 years were the most prosperous in a long time for people.
4. Wants to get the government out of our lives as much as possible.

And then we get to the Leftie "definition" of "Conservative" that you seem to want to redefine to meet your arguments.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to DaiTengu on Fri Nov 20 2020 09:33 am

Land doesn't vote. People do.

And I'll remind you that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

I'm quite aware.

Lefties like to ignore the facts that they don't like. The fact is that the Constutition set up a system where the President is the candidate that gets the most wide-spread support.

Incorrect. feel free to go back to school and read upon the "three-fifths compromise". The real reason we have the Electoral College is abhorrent.

The Constitution was set up so that it could be changed over the years. It's supposed to be a living document, yet it's been 49 years since we went through that process with the 26th amendment.

If you look at the maps, you will see that Biden got only a few, hightly populated areas of the country. Even here in Michigan, he got only the large cities. Not what I would call "wide-spread" support.

once again, Land doesn't vote. All but 2 states cast all their electoral college ballots for the presidential candidate that won the popular vote for that state. If the majority of the voting population lives in a city, and they overwhelmingly support a specific candidate, then that's all that matters. One person who lives in a 300sq foot apartment in a city has a vote that's worth the same as someone who owns hundreds and hundreds of acres of countryside.

DaiTengu

... Be an individualist. He who follows another is always behind.

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oh god trump made 2 million jobs. he is literally hitler

Yes, glad we are getting rid of him so that those poor 2 million folks can
go back to living off the dole or working minimum wage.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to MRO on Thu Nov 26 2020 11:04 am

Public sector jobs are not "real" jobs though. Any president could employ

okay i'll go tell that to the people i know that work in DC but live in really huge fucking houses and have nice everything in virginia and nearby states.

economy. A true Conservative belives in private ownership and Capitalism as an economic system, and that includes having a SMALL government.

He is more of an old school Democrat, the sort you'd find in the 70s-80s.

yes, as yahoo news says, he's a former reality show host. he's a businessman, not a politician.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Thu Nov 26 2020 09:49 am

oh god trump made 2 million jobs. he is literally hitler

Yes, glad we are getting rid of him so that those poor 2 million folks can go back to living off the dole or working minimum wage.

people are just lazy and pathetic. i joined my state's unemployment group on facebook. it's one where they complain about the many issues in wisconsin.

people have been sitting on their asses for 8 months just waiting for their unemployment payouts. they arent looking for work. i ask them why they are waiting so long when there's good paying jobs out there and they dont give the reasons and jump down my throat.

people want to sit at home and get high and have the government take care of them. my body is fucked up. i can barely walk because of an injured tendon in my leg and i am still on my feet all day and moving around.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Al on Thu Nov 26 2020 08:41 am

They wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was.

They wanted a prosecutor who was going after the corrupt company Hunter Biden was on the board off.

Big difference there.

There is and you continue to miss it.

That is what Donald Trump was doing. That is largely what got him
impeached.

*Yawn* Ya, a big nothing-burger from the Dems wasting all that time and money on their political games.

You dismiss the facts and cling to a conspiracy theory.

All you have is Leftie talking points. But for Lefties, the Narrative is reality. That's why Lefties are so mad and sad all the time: Reality won't go along with their Narrative.

I admit I enjoy a good conspiracy theory myself sometimes.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Sir, the Romulans do not take prisoners!

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On 11/26/2020 9:29 AM, DaiTengu wrote:

Incorrect. feel free to go back to school and read upon the
"three-fifths compromise". The real reason we have the Electoral
College is abhorrent.

Maybe *YOU* should go back to school, as the 3/5 compromise predates the electoral college, and doesn't have anything to do with Congressional representation for a century and a half, twice the lifetime of almost
everyone alive today.

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people are just lazy and pathetic. i joined my state's unemployment group on facebook. it's one where they complain about the many issues in wisconsin.

people have been sitting on their asses for 8 months just waiting for their un
ployment payouts. they arent looking for work. i ask them why they are waitin
so long when there's good paying jobs out there and they dont give the reasons
nd jump down my throat.

people want to sit at home and get high and have the government take care of t
m. my body is fucked up. i can barely walk because of an injured tendon in my
eg and i am still on my feet all day and moving around.

There are many elitist democratic voters who will tell you that those folks don't exist. I am glad I am not the only one who notices them. I live in
an area where most of my neighbors are older and retired. Something I had noticed before, and have again now that we are on WFH, is the number of
adult children who spend most of their time (in good weather) sitting on
their parent's front porches playing on their cell phones. They were doing
it before COVID, so there is no blaming it on that. They are basically
waiting for mom and dad to kick off so that they can have the house. A
couple of them have been sent up the river for dealing drugs off the porch. They are lazy af.

One of those neighbors moved out. A person closer to my age moved it. Her teenage/early-20's son has at least 2 jobs. Good to see that some kids
still want to work.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Andeddu on Thu Nov 26 2020 08:50 am

And then we get to the Leftie "definition" of "Conservative" that you seem to want to redefine to meet your arguments.

Ahem, you're calling me a "Leftie"? I said Trump, by today's standards, is ideologically Conservative, but his promulgation of an expanded government is counter-productive to economical prosperity.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Fri Nov 27 2020 10:27 am

There are many elitist democratic voters who will tell you that those folks don't exist. I am glad I am not the only one who notices them. I live in an area where most of my neighbors are older and retired. Something I had noticed before, and have again now that we are on WFH, is the number of adult children who spend most of their time (in good weather) sitting on their parent's front porches playing on their cell phones. They were doing it before COVID, so there is no blaming it on that. They are basically waiting for mom and dad to kick off so that they can have the house. A couple of them have been sent up the river for dealing drugs off the porch. They are lazy af.

One of those neighbors moved out. A person closer to my age moved it. Her teenage/early-20's son has at least 2 jobs. Good to see that some kids still want to work.

We call those kids "NiNis" in Spain. "_Ni_ Estudian _Ni_ Trabajan" (No job, no studying).

I don't think we have as many of those, but the ones we have seem to be concentrated in the same geographical areas. If you go to certain squares in Madrid it is easy to find people in the mid 20s that spend all their waking time partying in that square.

Then we have a curious phenomenon here when it comes to unemployment. Spain has produced a lot of gradutates as of late. When those graduates hit the job market, it turns out there are no vacancies for gradutates and that most demand is for VS. After a year trying to turn my good for nothing Engineering degree into a job I started applying for lower level jobs, and got always rejected because I was overqualified.

The same factory owners who sent me back home would then complain that no VS would take their job offers.

Seriously, this place deserves to rot.

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DaiTengu wrote to Dr. What <=-

Land doesn't vote. People do.

And I'll remind you that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

I'm quite aware.

Then why do you keep bringing up the idea of "popular vote" in context of the Presidental Election?

Lefties like to ignore the facts that they don't like. The fact is that

Incorrect. feel free to go back to school and read upon the
"three-fifths compromise". The real reason we have the Electoral
College is abhorrent.

I did read about the "three-fifths compromise". It's you who need to go back to school. You've obviously been incortrinated, not educated.

The Constitution was set up so that it could be changed over the years. It's supposed to be a living document, yet it's been 49 years since we went through that process with the 26th amendment.

Yes, it's a living document that has a well-documented process for changing it and it (obviously) works since since it's
been used 26 times so far.

What it doesn't allow (and this is what you Lefties don't like) is for it to be changed on a whim - and that's by design.

Of course, if you actually were educated in this, you would know that.

You might want to check out https://online.hillsdale.edu/#course-offerings
They offer free online courses - a couple specifically on the Constitution.


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Al wrote to Dr. What <=-

They wanted a corrupt prosecutor fired, and he was.

They wanted a prosecutor who was going after the corrupt company Hunter Biden was on the board off.

Big difference there.

There is and you continue to miss it.

Actually, I don't miss it. But you lefties want to keep dancing around yet another Biden crime.

You dismiss the facts and cling to a conspiracy theory.

Other way around. I cling to the facts but dismiss the delusions of the Left.

But this is what Scott Adams says about "Two people seeing completely different movies, while watching the same movie."


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Andeddu wrote to Dr. What <=-

And then we get to the Leftie "definition" of "Conservative" that you seem to want to redefine to meet your arguments.

Ahem, you're calling me a "Leftie"? I said Trump, by today's standards,
is ideologically Conservative, but his promulgation of an expanded government is counter-productive to economical prosperity.

And you've yet to show me the "expanded gov't".

I've already explained that "expanded gov't" has nothing to do with number of employees. It has to do with the amount of
intrusion the gov't has into people's lives.

Trump has greatly reduced the number of rules and regulations and other gov't intrusions into our lives.

So, I'm calling you a Leftie because you've used the standard Leftie tactic of redefining a term in order to
"win" the argument.


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We call those kids "NiNis" in Spain. "_Ni_ Estudian _Ni_ Trabajan" (No job, no >studying).

My Spanish is quite rusty, and was never good enough to carry on a conversation, but I did understand that bit. :)

Then we have a curious phenomenon here when it comes to unemployment. Spain has
produced a lot of gradutates as of late. When those graduates hit the job >market, it turns out there are no vacancies for gradutates and that most demand
is for VS. After a year trying to turn my good for nothing Engineering degree >into a job I started applying for lower level jobs, and got always rejected >because I was overqualified.

The same factory owners who sent me back home would then complain that no VS >would take their job offers.

What is a VS? I must admit that is one thing I am concerned with
personally. Once I retire from my current IT job, I hope to still be employable at least on a part-time basis. My recollection of past attempts
at getting a job outside of my field of study is that employers seem to
turn their noses up at people with an IT degree or IT background, I assume because they are afraid we have no social skills, or any skills that don't involve sitting in front of a computer screen.

I hope that is not the case.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Tracker1 to DaiTengu on Fri Nov 27 2020 06:44 am

Incorrect. feel free to go back to school and read upon the
"three-fifths compromise". The real reason we have the Electoral
College is abhorrent.

Maybe *YOU* should go back to school, as the 3/5 compromise predates the electoral college, and doesn't have anything to do with Congressional representation for a century and a half, twice the lifetime of almost everyone alive today.

Slaves were counted as 3/5 of a person in terms of population. Population was (is) how congressional seats are decided, which, in turn, is how many Electoral College votes a state gets.

DaiTengu

... Miss Stove seems to be going off the boil.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to DaiTengu on Sat Nov 28 2020 08:56 am

Land doesn't vote. People do.

And I'll remind you that we live in a Republic, not a Democracy.

I'm quite aware.

Then why do you keep bringing up the idea of "popular vote" in context of the Presidental Election?

Because all but two states give all their electoral college votes to whomever wins the popular vote in that state. nearly 1/5 of Wisconsin's population lives in a tiny area, called "Milwaukee", which covers 0.14% of Wisconsin's land mass. While Wisconsin was very much "red" in terms of counties (including the county I live in), the people in Wisconsin voted for Biden as their president. The argument was that the vast majority of the US was "red" while only tiny areas were "blue". My point stands, and is factual. Land does not vote.

You've obviously been incortrinated, not educated.

You're adorable, you keep thinking that, Mr. Dr. robot.

The Constitution was set up so that it could be changed over

the years. It's supposed to be a living document, yet it's been 49
years since we went through that process with the 26th amendment.

Yes, it's a living document that has a well-documented process for changing it and it (obviously) works since since it's
been used 26 times so far.

What it doesn't allow (and this is what you Lefties don't like) is for it to be changed on a whim - and that's by design.

Of course, if you actually were educated in this, you would know that.

You might want to check out https://online.hillsdale.edu/#course-offerings They offer free online courses - a couple specifically on the Constitution.

27 times. There are 27 Amendments to the constitution. The 27th Amendment was ratified in 1992, but the process for it began 202 years prior.

But you know, I'm the one that needs courses on the Consitution, while Mr. Dr. Robot here doesn't even know how many Amendments there are.

DaiTengu

... A sense of decency is often a decent man's undoing.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Andeddu on Sat Nov 28 2020 09:02 am

And you've yet to show me the "expanded gov't".

I've already explained that "expanded gov't" has nothing to do with number o employees. It has to do with the amount of
intrusion the gov't has into people's lives.

I agree that the expansiveness of a government is better messured by how much in intrudes in people's lives, but then, having a big workforce in its pocket is _usually_ an indication that it is expansive.

I mean, it takes taxes to keep that workforce, and when that workforce is big, it is big for a reason. Either to buy votes (easy to make your workers vote for you when you are in the government), or to better intrude in the lives of everybody else.

But I think the conversation misses the point.

The core factor that separates conservatives from progressives is that conservatives adhere themselves to a set of traditional morals and cultural principles, while progresives reject them. That is why General Francisco Franco is considered a conservative despite the fact he was a hardcore socialist at heart. He was socializing everything in name of God and Country :-P
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to ARELOR on Sat Nov 28 2020 10:42 am

What is a VS? I must admit that is one thing I am concerned with personally. Once I retire from my current IT job, I hope to still be employable at least on a part-time basis. My recollection of past attempts at getting a job outside of my field of study is that employers seem to
turn their noses up at people with an IT degree or IT background, I assume because they are afraid we have no social skills, or any skills that don't involve sitting in front of a computer screen.

I hope that is not the case.

VS would be Vocational Studies. If I am not mistaken, those are the equivalent of the Spanish FP (Formaci¢n Profesional).

Piece of advice here: when applying to a low grade job, remove any reference to high profile IT qualifications. People does not seem to read past them when they find it in your CV, they just put it in the trash bin after reading that part :-( Main reason I am goign so hard at writing and setting my e-commerces nowadays is that my employability seems to be quite low if only for this reason.

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Slaves were counted as 3/5 of a person in terms of population. Population was
is) how congressional seats are decided, which, in turn, is how many Electoral >ollege votes a state gets.

That whole statement is not true. You talk as if the number was decided then and never changed. As the 3/5ths compromise is no longer used, everyone counts as 1. The number of congressional seats, and electoral votes, a state gets
can change. Smaller states have seen their numbers go down, while larger states have seen their numbers go up.

The 3/5ths compromise no longer has anything to do with determining how
many congresspeople/votes a state gets.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to DAITENGU on Sun Nov 29 2020 03:20 pm

That whole statement is not true. You talk as if the number was decided then and never changed. As the 3/5ths compromise is no longer used, everyone counts as 1. The number of congressional seats, and electoral votes, a state gets can change. Smaller states have seen their numbers go down, while larger states have seen their numbers go up.

The 3/5ths compromise no longer has anything to do with determining how many congresspeople/votes a state gets.

I never said it was. It did have everything to do with its creation, however.

DaiTengu

... Fear is no great respecter of reason.

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The 3/5ths compromise no longer has anything to do with determining how many congresspeople/votes a state gets.

I never said it was. It did have everything to do with its creation, however.

Congressional Representation had everything to do with the creation of the 3/5ths compromise, yes.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to Andeddu on Sat Nov 28 2020 09:02 am

And you've yet to show me the "expanded gov't".

I've already explained that "expanded gov't" has nothing to do with number of employees. It has to do with the amount of
intrusion the gov't has into people's lives.

Trump has greatly reduced the number of rules and regulations and other gov't intrusions into our lives.

So, I'm calling you a Leftie because you've used the standard Leftie tactic of redefining a term in order to
"win" the argument.

I am talking about the literal size of government from an economic standpoint which has nothing to do with governemnt intrusion. Capitalists believe in a literal small government, not a bloated inefficent cash-sink. I think Trump's active resistance against the "deep state" shows that he's anti-government intrusion. I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands of miles away from me.

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On 11/28/2020 1:45 PM, DaiTengu wrote:

Maybe *YOU* should go back to school, as the 3/5 compromise predates the
electoral college, and doesn't have anything to do with Congressional
representation for a century and a half, twice the lifetime of almost
everyone alive today.

Slaves were counted as 3/5 of a person in terms of population. Population
was (is) how congressional seats are decided, which, in turn, is how many Electoral College votes a state gets.

Are you proposing another method of determining how many Congressional
seats a give state gets?

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Re: Re: Election
By: Tracker1 to DaiTengu on Mon Nov 30 2020 04:11 pm

Are you proposing another method of determining how many Congressional seats a give state gets?

No, I'm proposing we scrap the EC and vote for president the same way governors of states are elected, by popular vote.

DaiTengu

... If little else, the brain is an educational toy.

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Andeddu wrote to Dr. What <=-

So, I'm calling you a Leftie because you've used the standard Leftie tactic of redefining a term in order to "win" the argument.

I am talking about the literal size of government from an
economic standpoint which has nothing to do with governemnt
intrusion. Capitalists believe in a literal small government, not
a bloated inefficent cash-sink. I think Trump's active resistance
against the "deep state" shows that he's anti-government
intrusion. I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not
here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands
of miles away from me.

Good point there at the end. Why *ARE* you so obsessed with the
goings on of the USA? You're not a citizen and you don't live here.
STFU and mind your own business.



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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Tue Dec 01 2020 11:43 am

Good point there at the end. Why *ARE* you so obsessed with the
goings on of the USA? You're not a citizen and you don't live here.
STFU and mind your own business.

I can't talk for Andeddu, but my own take is this:

The US is the major exporter of culture in the Western world, and its main economical
agent. Bad stuff that happens there will eventually reach us one way or another.

I mean, I am not French either, but if they started experimenting with bioweapons I'd
get concerned they could explode in ther faces and affect us :-P

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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Tue Dec 01 2020 11:43 am

intrusion. I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not
here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands
of miles away from me.

Good point there at the end. Why *ARE* you so obsessed with the
goings on of the USA? You're not a citizen and you don't live here.
STFU and mind your own business.

That'll be shining... why would I ever listen to someone like you?

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Re: Re: Election
By: Arelor to Gamgee on Tue Dec 01 2020 05:49 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Tue Dec 01 2020 11:43 am

Good point there at the end. Why *ARE* you so obsessed with the
goings on of the USA? You're not a citizen and you don't live here.
STFU and mind your own business.

I can't talk for Andeddu, but my own take is this:

The US is the major exporter of culture in the Western world, and its main economica agent. Bad stuff that happens there will eventually reach us one > way or another.

Yes, understood and agreed.

I mean, I am not French either, but if they started experimenting with bioweapons I'd get concerned they could explode in ther faces and affect us > :-P

Yup, I agree with that too. The difference is that you don't constantly spew doom and gloom, and anti-USA drivel, and outright lies, the way this Andeddu character does. I get tired of his crap.

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DaiTengu wrote to Tracker1 <=-

No, I'm proposing we scrap the EC and vote for president the same way governors of states are elected, by popular vote.

Which, had you actually been educated about the Constutution and the Electoral College, would result in the majority of the country being disenfranchised.


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DaiTengu wrote to Tracker1 <=-

Re: Re: Election
By: Tracker1 to DaiTengu on Mon Nov 30 2020 04:11 pm

Are you proposing another method of determining how many Congressional seats a give state gets?

No, I'm proposing we scrap the EC and vote for president the same way governors of states are elected, by popular vote.

Then you end up like here in California where we are "lorded" over by Bay Area clowns that have no idea, or maybe don't give a shit, about our needs and wants in the rural areas. Most counties in Eastern, Northern and even some Southern Counties are Red. Bay Area, L.A. Area and maybe Sacramento and San Diego Areas control the elections. There's a whole lot more of the state that gets no real say and is forgotten about.




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Dr. What wrote to DaiTengu <=-

DaiTengu wrote to Tracker1 <=-

No, I'm proposing we scrap the EC and vote for president the same way governors of states are elected, by popular vote.

Which, had you actually been educated about the Constutution and the Electoral College, would result in the majority of the country being disenfranchised.

Exactly!!




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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Arelor on Tue Dec 01 2020 09:07 pm

Yup, I agree with that too. The difference is that you don't constantly spew doom and gloom, and anti-USA drivel, and outright lies, the way this Andeddu character does. I get tired of his crap.

I don't like what's happening in the USA (as it'll affect us all globally) and I have a right to voice my opinion whether you like it or not. If you don't like it, don't engage with me. And if you do engage with me, at least attempt to debate my arguments rather than just slinging insults my way; you'll look more credible if you do. It's not rocket science, bud. There's no need to be so sensitive over the opinions of someone over the internet. I am not even purposely trying to trigger you! Why get upset when you're on DOVE-NET of all places... this isn't even Facebook, Reddit, 4Chan or any form of relevant social media!

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Yup, I agree with that too. The difference is that you don't constantly spew >doom and gloom, and anti-USA drivel, and outright lies, the way this Andeddu ch
racter does. I get tired of his crap.

Maybe it is because I moderate the FIDO Politics echo and have seen a lot
of drivel in comparison, but I find most of Andeddu's posts here to be fairly non-anti-USA.


* SLMR 2.1a * Hey, how 'bout a fandango ?!?

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Then you end up like here in California where we are "lorded" over by Bay Area >clowns that have no idea, or maybe don't give a shit, about our needs and wants
in the rural areas. Most counties in Eastern, Northern and even some Southern >Counties are Red. Bay Area, L.A. Area and maybe Sacramento and San Diego Areas >control the elections. There's a whole lot more of the state that gets no real >say and is forgotten about.

People who tend to lean blue won't see that as a bad thing. If your folks
in the Bay/LA/etc. areas are like some of our folks in Louisville, they get some enjoyment out of the possibility of making the rest of the state miserable.


* SLMR 2.1a * Innocent critters *squashed* on the highway of life!

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Andeddu wrote to Gamgee <=-

Yup, I agree with that too. The difference is that you don't constantly spew doom and gloom, and anti-USA drivel, and outright lies, the way this Andeddu character does. I get tired of his crap.

I don't like what's happening in the USA (as it'll affect us all
globally) and I have a right to voice my opinion whether you like
it or not. If you don't like it, don't engage with me. And if you
do engage with me, at least attempt to debate my arguments rather
than just slinging insults my way; you'll look more credible if
you do. It's not rocket science, bud. There's no need to be so
sensitive over the opinions of someone over the internet. I am
not even purposely trying to trigger you! Why get upset when
you're on DOVE-NET of all places... this isn't even Facebook,
Reddit, 4Chan or any form of relevant social media!

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?



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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Wed Dec 02 2020 08:03 pm

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

Hey, what's wrong with a man-bun? :P

Nightfox

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Nightfox wrote to Gamgee <=-

Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Wed Dec 02 2020 08:03 pm

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

Hey, what's wrong with a man-bun? :P

Heh, let's just say.... I'm not a fan. ;-)



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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Wed Dec 02 2020 08:03 pm

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

Yes and no. :)

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to GAMGEE on Wed Dec 02 2020 05:41 pm

Maybe it is because I moderate the FIDO Politics echo and have seen a lot
of drivel in comparison, but I find most of Andeddu's posts here to be fairly non-anti-USA.

I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but it can do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy and upset when 'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Dumas Walker on Thu Dec 03 2020 06:08 pm

I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but it can do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy and upset when 'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

We should be able to take criticism of one's own country - and even be able to criticize it ourselves when appropriate. I see it as patriotic to recognize things that are wrong with one's country and want to fix them.

Nightfox

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Dumas Walker on Thu Dec 03 2020 06:08 pm

I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but it can do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy and upset when 'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic. upset when 'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

what about your fucked up country? why don't they do better?
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dr. What to DaiTengu on Wed Dec 02 2020 09:08 am

Which, had you actually been educated about the Constutution and the Electoral College, would result in the majority of the country being disenfranchised.

How so? the majority of the population of our country lives in large cities.


Yes, those cities tend to vote Democratic quite heavily.

Unless you're trying to say the majority of the land would be disenfranchised, because that would be a true statement.

But then again, my whole point in this thread has been: Land does not vote. People do.

DaiTengu

... Use it up.Wear it out. Make it do Or do without.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Thumper to DaiTengu on Wed Dec 02 2020 10:06 am

Then you end up like here in California where we are "lorded" over by Bay Area clowns that have no idea, or maybe don't give a shit, about our needs and wants in the rural areas. Most counties in Eastern, Northern and even some Southern Counties are Red. Bay Area, L.A. Area and maybe Sacramento and San Diego Areas control the elections. There's a whole lot more of the state that gets no real say and is forgotten about.

There is a whole lot more LAND. There is not a whole lot more population.

DaiTengu

... A day without sunshine is like night.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Thu Dec 03 2020 08:30 am

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

Hey, what's wrong with a man-bun? :P

Everything.

DaiTengu

... I shot an arrow into the air, and it stuck.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Nightfox to Andeddu on Thu Dec 03 2020 05:17 pm

I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but it can do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy and upset when 'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

We should be able to take criticism of one's own country - and even be able to criticize it ourselves when appropriate. I see it as patriotic to recognize things that are wrong with one's country and want to fix them.

Nightfox

I would be inclinded to agree. Unless the flaws are pointed out, they can never be addressed. I said one thing to criticise Trump and a number of posters took it personally and jumped down my throat, which I found to be quite amusing as the snowflake mentality is characteristically angled towards the Left rather than the Right whereas the reality appears to be that both sides can be as bad as each other. I like Trump and if I were as US citizen, he'd have gotten my vote... but he sure isn't perfect! The USA, as a nation, is far from perfect either and the reason I have made my opinion known is that I'd like the US global hegemony maintained and not have it usurped in under a decade by a country like China.

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Re: Re: Election
By: MRO to Andeddu on Thu Dec 03 2020 07:56 pm

what about your fucked up country? why don't they do better?

We should, but we haven't really spoken about the UK because I don't think you people know too much about it. The UK also doesn't have the clout that the USA has in the international arena, so it's less relevant.

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DaiTengu wrote to Dr. What <=-

Which, had you actually been educated about the Constutution and the Electoral College, would result in the majority of the country being disenfranchised.

How so? the majority of the population of our country lives in large cities.

Your question demonstrates ignorance of the Constutition and why some of the things in it were set up the way they were.

It is not my job to educate you. I will once again point you to https://online.hillsdale.edu/courses/constitution-101
This is a free online class that will educate you.

But it only works if you can accept information that goes counter to your narrative.


... Honk if you love obscene gestures.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Nightfox on Fri Dec 04 2020 08:31 am

I would be inclinded to agree. Unless the flaws are pointed out, they can never be addressed. I said one thing to criticise Trump and a number of posters took it personally and jumped down my throat, which I found to be quite amusing as the snowflake mentality is characteristically angled towards the Left rather than the Right whereas the reality appears to be that both sides can be as bad as each other. I like Trump and if I were as

There seems to be a double standard and a bit of hypocrisy about that. People don't like when other people criticize their candidate/party of choice, but they're also quick to criticize the other candidate/party..

Nightfox

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I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but it can >do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy and upset when
'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

I get touchy if they always criticise my country but never criticise, or
even discuss, their own, or seem overly obsessed with my country's
leadership. Otherwise, I feel they are free to their opinion. :)


* SLMR 2.1a * "I am EVIL Homer! I am EVIL Homer!" - Homer

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We should, but we haven't really spoken about the UK because I don't think you >people know too much about it. The UK also doesn't have the clout that the USA >has in the international arena, so it's less relevant.

Tell us more about it and we will know.


* SLMR 2.1a * "Gasoline clears my sinuses!" - Fred G. Sanford

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Dr. What on Tue Dec 01 2020 02:09 am

I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands of miles away from me.

Then why are you posting in the "Debate" section of the boards?

Hello?

Gamer?

þ Crystal Palace, Orbitsville þ

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Gamgee on Wed Dec 02 2020 06:24 pm

Why get upset when you're on DOVE-NET of all places... this isn't even Facebook, Reddit, 4Chan or any form of relevant social media!

Whao whao whaooooooo dude.

Why have you gotta shit on DOVE-NET like that man? I think this place is relevant.

þ Crystal Palace, Orbitsville þ

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Re: Re: Election
By: Gamgee to Andeddu on Wed Dec 02 2020 08:03 pm

Andeddu wrote to Gamgee <=-

not even purposely trying to trigger you! Why get upset when
you're on DOVE-NET of all places... this isn't even Facebook,
Reddit, 4Chan or any form of relevant social media!

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

https://clips.twitch.tv/MoistSleepyTapirTheRinger

þ Crystal Palace, Orbitsville þ

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Re: Re: Election
By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Thu Dec 03 2020 08:30 am

Hey, what's wrong with a man-bun? :P

Everyone take note, this man is defending the man bun.

þ Crystal Palace, Orbitsville þ

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Re: Re: Election
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Thu Dec 03 2020 08:35 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Nightfox to Gamgee on Thu Dec 03 2020 08:30 am

Do you wear skinny-jeans and have a man-bun?

Hey, what's wrong with a man-bun? :P

Everything.

DaiTengu

This guy gets it.

þ Crystal Palace, Orbitsville þ

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Re: Re: Election
By: Nightfox to Andeddu on Fri Dec 04 2020 09:24 am

There seems to be a double standard and a bit of hypocrisy about that. People don't like when other people criticize their candidate/party of choice, but they're also quick to criticize the other candidate/party..

Nightfox

Absolutely. Both groups are as bad as each other. I do agree with certain Leftist views however I am more of a Conservative than anything, but I can see the double standard as clear as day. The Right get very sensitive whenever their political figures/policy is criticised as much as the Left complain and throw their toys out the pram whenever their's are criticised. It's the same with the Left always banging on about Right wing conspiracy theories when they're guilty of disseminating their own "Russian collusion" conspiracy theory for years and continue to do so after it being debunked.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to ANDEDDU on Fri Dec 04 2020 11:06 am

I get touchy if they always criticise my country but never criticise, or even discuss, their own, or seem overly obsessed with my country's leadership. Otherwise, I feel they are free to their opinion. :)

Feel free to criticise the UK. I will either defend it if I feel you are incorrect, or heartily agree with you. The USA is the most powerful and influential country in the world which is why it's being discussed by foreigners. My country doesn't appear to be able to push world policy... we are unable to even negotiate Brexit within a suitable timeframe.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to ANDEDDU on Fri Dec 04 2020 11:24 am

Tell us more about it and we will know.

The UK isn't particularly important on the world stage right now. MRO is right, there is no even partnership between our countries like during the Thatcher/Reagan era... since Blair, you have been the dog and we have been the tail.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Vlk-451 to Andeddu on Fri Dec 04 2020 06:52 pm

I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands of miles away from me.

Then why are you posting in the "Debate" section of the boards?

Debates aren't arguments.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Vlk-451 to Andeddu on Fri Dec 04 2020 07:18 pm

Why get upset when you're on DOVE-NET of all places... this isn't even Facebook, Reddit, 4Chan or any form of relevant social media!

Whao whao whaooooooo dude.

Why have you gotta shit on DOVE-NET like that man? I think this place is relevant.

Yeah, it was relevant...




before I was born!

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There seems to be a double standard and a bit of hypocrisy about that. People >on't like when other people criticize their candidate/party of choice, but they
re also quick to criticize the other candidate/party..

True but, in this particular case, the person making the criticism has no candidate because they don't live here. People got angry because some
Russians on FB were supposedly telling us who to vote for in our US election, so I think people here have just as much of a right to get upset when it seems someone who does not live in our country is trying to influence people politically.

There are one or two in the FIDO Politics echo who do that for sure. Then there are others who express an opinion but also tell us about how things
are going in their own country. I don't mind that as much.


* SLMR 2.1a * Life after death - is that Terminate and Stay Resident?

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to NIGHTFOX on Sat Dec 05 2020 10:19 am

There seems to be a double standard and a bit of hypocrisy about that.
People on't like when other people criticize their candidate/party of
choice, but they re also quick to criticize the other candidate/party..

True but, in this particular case, the person making the criticism has no candidate because they don't live here. People got angry because some

I was replying to his comment that Trump supporters take it personally when he criticized Trump, when usually leftists tend to be known as snowflakes.

Nightfox

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Vlk-451 on Sat Dec 05 2020 01:38 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Vlk-451 to Andeddu on Fri Dec 04 2020 06:52 pm

I don't think there's an argument to "win"... I am not here to argue over the interwebz with some dude located thousands of miles away from me.

Then why are you posting in the "Debate" section of the boards?

Debates aren't arguments.

From some article in a DuckDuckGo search:

A 'debate', as a noun, is understood as a formal discussion between people or groups of people that is regulated. Interestingly, debates are considered based on 'arguments', which are lines of reasoning, support or evidence about a subject. However, a debate has the feeling of a larger, longer or more formal discussion. A formal debate may even be judged by a person or a panel of people, with one side winning the debate by providing the best lines of reasoning or support for the issue. For example, She argued that people should have the right to decide about their own medical care at the debate.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to ANDEDDU on Fri Dec 04 2020 11:06 am

I am defintely not anti-USA. On the contrary, I support the USA... but
it can do better. It's just that certain people on here get VERY touchy
and upset

when

'outsiders' criticise their utopian constitutional Republic.

I get touchy if they always criticise my country but never criticise, or even discuss, their own, or seem overly obsessed with my country's leadership. Otherwise, I feel they are free to their opinion. :)

if people from other countries criticize the usa it's usually because of their media is so sensationalized. they've been that way a lot longer than our media has been.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Nightfox on Sat Dec 05 2020 01:23 pm

It's the same with the Left always banging on about Right wing conspiracy

theories when they're guilty of disseminating their own "Russian collusion" conspiracy theory for years and continue to do so after it being debunked.

How was it debunked? Several including Roger Stone were convicted and sentenced for their crimes although Roger Stone never did his time because Donald Trump commuted his sentence and has now pardoned Michael Flynn. I don't know if Michael Flynn's pardon will stick since his case hasn't concluded yet.

Russian collusion was never a conspiracy theory. A large number of people were convicted and sentenced for their roles.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... What?! I'm missing Star Tre$#%$^ NO CARRIER

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The UK isn't particularly important on the world stage right now. MRO is right,
there is no even partnership between our countries like during the >Thatcher/Reagan era... since Blair, you have been the dog and we have been the >tail.

Why do you suppose Blair (or the US) let it get that way?


* SLMR 2.1a * Goodness! That was close! I almost gave a damn.

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I was replying to his comment that Trump supporters take it personally when he >riticized Trump, when usually leftists tend to be known as snowflakes.

While I know some people are upset, I have not seen any screaming or crying
at a protest because Biden won. I have not seen people I thought were
rational adults having breakdowns on FB because Biden won. Four years ago, there were examples all over. That is the first time I remember hearing snowflake used. Get back with me when those kind of emotional breakdowns
start happening on as widespread of a basis and I may see your point.

OTOH, soon we will see what happens when the late night folks start telling Biden jokes in place of Trump ones. I never watch the Daily Show but,
based on the ads, Trevor Noah is going to have to get a lot funnier than he
is. I never thought his Trump jokes were funny, but know people who did. The other day I saw one where he told Biden jokes. He is still not funny, and
I doubt any Biden supporter will get a kick out of those jokes, either.


* SLMR 2.1a * What is mind? No matter! What is matter? Never mind!

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I get touchy if they always criticise my country but never criticise, or even discuss, their own, or seem overly obsessed with my country's leadership. Otherwise, I feel they are free to their opinion. :)

if people from other countries criticize the usa it's usually because of their >edia is so sensationalized. they've been that way a lot longer than our media >as been.

Yes, or they've been watching our media. It would be nice if the media
would quit trying to compete with the cable news and the internet and just present the news for what it is and not the entertainment value.


* SLMR 2.1a * The number you have dailed...9-1-1...has been changed...

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Re: Re: Election
By: Vlk-451 to Andeddu on Sat Dec 05 2020 01:31 pm

A 'debate', as a noun, is understood as a formal discussion between people or groups of people that is regulated. Interestingly, debates are considered based on 'arguments', which are lines of reasoning, support or evidence about a subject. However, a debate has the feeling of a larger, longer or more formal discussion. A formal debate may even be judged by a person or a panel of people, with one side winning the debate by providing the best lines of reasoning or support for the issue. For example, She argued that people should have the right to decide about their own medical care at the debate.

A lot of the time certain posters here constitute a 'debate' as hurling insults at one another. I won't name names, but it's fairly evident who they are.

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Re: Re: Election
By: MRO to Dumas Walker on Sat Dec 05 2020 03:54 pm

if people from other countries criticize the usa it's usually because of their media is so sensationalized. they've been that way a lot longer than our media has been.

That's true. In the UK all you get is Trump bashing from the media. Even when he visited us all they banged on about was how much he was disrespecting our Queen, etc...

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Re: Re: Election
By: Al to Andeddu on Sat Dec 05 2020 01:34 pm

How was it debunked? Several including Roger Stone were convicted and sentenced for their crimes although Roger Stone never did his time because Donald Trump commuted his sentence and has now pardoned Michael Flynn. I don't know if Michael Flynn's pardon will stick since his case hasn't concluded yet.

Russian collusion was never a conspiracy theory. A large number of people were convicted and sentenced for their roles.

Last I checked, which was a long time ago, the Mueller Report returned with no sufficient evidence in relation to a Trump-Russia conspiracy.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Al on Sun Dec 06 2020 04:27 pm

Russian collusion was never a conspiracy theory. A large number of
people were convicted and sentenced for their roles.

Last I checked, which was a long time ago, the Mueller Report returned with no sufficient evidence in relation to a Trump-Russia conspiracy.

The Mueller investigation was never about charging Donald Trump since he was a sitting president at the time, but it never exonerated him either.

https://youtu.be/HMp9_f-jxDw

Mueller himself said that Donald Trump could be charged with obstruction based on what he saw.

https://youtu.be/wDBBSLqLhT4

Ttyl :-),
Al

... I'm sure it's all clearly explained in the Zmodem DOC's

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to NIGHTFOX on Sun Dec 06 2020 11:03 am

While I know some people are upset, I have not seen any screaming or crying at a protest because Biden won. I have not seen people I thought were rational adults having breakdowns on FB because Biden won. Four years ago,

As far as I am aware, who won has not been settled at all.

I am not following the events *that*c closely but investigations regarding contested votes are turning interesting things. Like those machines that were scannign votes and assigning them to the wrong party, or people caught scanning the same set of votes multiple times.

My mother was running numbers earlier this morning and told me none of the candidates has votes enough to become elect president once you substract the votes that are under non-baseless investigation.

In fact I find it disturbing when a lot of media is reporting that things are settled and Trump is conceeding. Specially because somebody showed me a headline from a Spanish journal which claimed Trump was conceeding while Trump himself was posting he didn't on Twitter.
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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to ANDEDDU on Sun Dec 06 2020 09:52 am

Why do you suppose Blair (or the US) let it get that way?

I don't know. Perhaps it was to do with Blair not having a forceful or particularly strong personality. He was allegedly pushed around by Gordon Brown, his Chancellor, while he was Prime Minister. Bush wasn't really in awe with him either... I still recall the "Yo, Blair!" incident, haha.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Al to Andeddu on Sun Dec 06 2020 03:15 pm

The Mueller investigation was never about charging Donald Trump since he was a sitting president at the time, but it never exonerated him either.

https://youtu.be/HMp9_f-jxDw

Mueller himself said that Donald Trump could be charged with obstruction based on what he saw.

https://youtu.be/wDBBSLqLhT4

I don't know enough about the investigation because I considered it too tedious to pay attention to. I only saw that the Mueller Report returned with non-sufficency to prove a definitive connection. I don't know how Russia could influence an election in any meaningful and widespread way. I know they would surely have tried, but that's par for the course in international politics. Every country tries to meddle in every other country's elections. I don't doubt there's a realistic possibility Trump could be charged with something but it would be similar charges to Roger Stone and Michael Flynn. Those were obstruction charges, or similar, not charges of conspiracy and collusion.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Arelor to Dumas Walker on Sun Dec 06 2020 05:36 pm

As far as I am aware, who won has not been settled at all.

I am not following the events *that*c closely but investigations regarding contested votes are turning interesting things. Like those machines that were scannign votes and assigning them to the wrong party, or people caught scanning the same set of votes multiple times.

My mother was running numbers earlier this morning and told me none of the candidates has votes enough to become elect president once you substract the votes that are under non-baseless investigation.

In fact I find it disturbing when a lot of media is reporting that things are settled and Trump is conceeding. Specially because somebody showed me a headline from a Spanish journal which claimed Trump was conceeding while Trump himself was posting he didn't on Twitter.

Did you see the CCTV footage of the Georgia count? It looks pretty damning to me. They apparently debunked any foul play shortly after the election due to the absence of CCTV footage, however the recent revelation of the footage will require much explanation.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Al on Mon Dec 07 2020 12:42 pm

I don't know enough about the investigation because I considered it too tedious to pay attention to.

It is tedious, much like the current stolen election thread but I think it's important to have and look at the facts.

I only saw that the Mueller Report returned with non-sufficency to prove a definitive connection.

That's what Bill Barr had to say but Mueller contradicted his conclusion

I don't know how Russia could influence an election in any meaningful and widespread way. I know they would surely have tried, but that's par for the course in international politics. Every country tries to meddle in every other country's elections.

Social media is one of the main ways today. It's a great way to spread lies and misinformation.

I don't doubt there's a realistic possibility Trump could be charged with something

Obstruction at least. It's unclear if he had a direct role in that. I think he simply used people like Roger Stone and Michael Flynn to get his deeds done.

but it would be similar charges to Roger Stone and Michael Flynn. Those were obstruction charges, or similar, not charges of conspiracy and collusion.

Roger Stone and Michael Flynn were involved in a conspiracy and collusion. Roger Stone was charged with seven felonies and convicted on all counts. They involved lying to congress and witness tampering.

When Michael Flynn's involvement was discovered he pleaded guilty and cooperated with the investigation. Later he changed his mind and wanted to change his plea to not guilty. His cases has not yet concluded.

There is a large number of folks, American and otherwise that were convicted of crimes related to the Russia investigation. Most will not be considered for a presidential pardon.

There is no conspiracy theory here.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Gee! How'd you ever get it to do THAT?

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My mother was running numbers earlier this morning and told me none of the candidates has votes enough to become elect president once you substract the votes that are under non-baseless investigation.

Some of that is not actually true. Some of the other accusations, though,
are things that have been caught on video. The explanations of what was
caught is always a basic "no evidence of any fraud has been found." They
don't explain what is going on in the videos. I would be much more
satisfied with "we looked into this and what the tape shows is (a shift change/people being sent home who could not work overtime/something else
that makes sense), and does not show anything fradulent going on."

But that is not the explanation that is making it out into the press, which does make it seem suspicious. They need to do a better job of explaining
"no evidence." All they are doing by not doing so is helping Trump keeps
his base stirred up.


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Did you see the CCTV footage of the Georgia count? It looks pretty damning to me. They apparently debunked any foul play shortly after the election due to the absence of CCTV footage, however the recent revelation of the footage will
require much explanation.

They are trying to debunk that with the standard "no evidence of fraud"
line but, IMHO, they could really shoot Trump down by actually looking into that instance and giving a brief explanation as to what the video shows.


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I don't know enough about the investigation because I considered it too tedious to pay attention to. I only saw that the Mueller Report returned with non-sufficency to prove a definitive connection. I don't know how Russia could influence an election in any meaningful and widespread way. I know they would surely have tried, but that's par for the course in international politics. Every country tries to meddle in every other country's elections. I don't doubt there's a realistic possibility Trump could be charged with something but it would be similar charges to Roger Stone and Michael Flynn. Those were obstruction charges, or similar, not charges of conspiracy and collusion.

Be careful. Some who will respond to you, saying they know all about it actually have as much (or less) of a grasp on it than you do.
#

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Dumas Walker wrote to ANDEDDU <=-

Did you see the CCTV footage of the Georgia count? It looks pretty damning

to

me. They apparently debunked any foul play shortly after the election due to the absence of CCTV footage, however the recent revelation of the footage

will

require much explanation.

They are trying to debunk that with the standard "no evidence of fraud" line but, IMHO, they could really shoot Trump down by actually looking into that instance and giving a brief explanation as to what the video shows.

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer of credibility now.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dennisk to Dumas Walker on Wed Dec 09 2020 09:07 pm

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer of credibility now.

The allegations of fraud were never dismissed. This election has been looked over time and again. There have been hearings and investigations but never any real evidence of a stolen election.

Here in the message areas we can make any kind of claims we want and argue day and night.

In a court if you make allegations you have to have proof and none has been provided.

Ttyl :-),
Al

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Hello Al!

** On Wednesday 09.12.20 - 08:27, al wrote to Dennisk:

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no De>> alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a De>> veneer of credibility now.

The allegations of fraud were never dismissed. This election has been looked over time and again. There have been hearings and investigations but never any real evidence of a stolen election.

Here in the message areas we can make any kind of claims we want and argue day and night.

In a court if you make allegations you have to have proof and none has been provided.

I thought that in situations like this the obvious step would
be to "launch an inquiry". That process would allow the
seeking of evidence - wouldn't it?

Inquiries are designed to facilitate the processes to access
records, films, documents, and scrutinize everything.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dennisk to Dumas Walker on Wed Dec 09 2020 09:07 pm

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a vene of credibility now.

Because the whole system is Freudulent. What would they do if they allowed it? Toss out the entire election? Preidents are just puppets. They are really not that important and do not have the power people believe they have. It's time to move on.

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They are trying to debunk that with the standard "no evidence of fraud" line but, IMHO, they could really shoot Trump down by actually looking into that instance and giving a brief explanation as to what the video shows.

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no >alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer >of credibility now.

Yes, that is it, like they've stopped trying.

It would not take much effort at all to give decent explanations for all of
the stuff that has made it on video. Doing so would completely kick the
feet out from under the claims that Trump and his team are making. It
seems like such an easy thing to do for anyone trying to be credible.

It is how I would handle it, unless I realized something really was going
on in the videos. Not being a politician, I would still handle it that way even if it was bad news.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Ogg to All on Wed Dec 09 2020 09:02 am

I thought that in situations like this the obvious step would
be to "launch an inquiry". That process would allow the
seeking of evidence - wouldn't it?

There have been an continues to be so many enquiries, all out in the open for everyone to see.

The votes have been counted and recounted in many of the swing states. Election authorities and governors in those states have not thrown out the election results even when invited to the white house for talks with Donald Trump because they have held free and fair elections in those states and the people have spoken.

Why would they do otherwise?

Inquiries are designed to facilitate the processes to access
records, films, documents, and scrutinize everything.

Texas has taken other states to court, the supreme court, because the people in those states choose differently than the people in their state! I might call that hilarious but it's not funny.

This could only happen in Donald Trumps world. No other president has talked of rigged elections the way Donald Trump has ever since he decided to run in the 2016 election. That's his and now the GOP narrative.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... for it is the doom of men that they forget.

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It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer of credibility now.

The allegations of fraud were never dismissed. This election has been looked ov
r time and again. There have been hearings and investigations but never any rea
evidence of a stolen election.

The only explanation of the allegation we are talking about, the one
actually caught on tape, so far has been a public parroting of "no evidence."

If they want to be transparent and kick the legs out from under Trump, they would explain it better than that. Dennis is correct. They don't want to provide an explanation.

Just a few months ago, something else got caught on tape that everyone
wanted an explanation for. The Minneapolis cops could not explain it
because there was no legitimate explanation for it. They screwed up bad
and everyone knew it.

The potential crime is much different, but this explanation is just as bad.


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I thought that in situations like this the obvious step would
be to "launch an inquiry". That process would allow the
seeking of evidence - wouldn't it?

Inquiries are designed to facilitate the processes to access
records, films, documents, and scrutinize everything.

Not if it is against a D or the D organization. If it is against them, we
need to sweep it under the rug ASAP.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Wed Dec 09 2020 03:49 pm

If they want to be transparent

Where is this lack of transparency?

and kick the legs out from under Trump, they would explain it better than that. Dennis is correct. They don't want to provide an explanation.

There was an election, the votes were counted and Joe Biden was declared the winner of that election.

Those votes have since been recounted in a number of cases and election officials have certified the election. Does Joe Biden now need to prove that he won that election?

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Reality is for those who can't handle computers.

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Al wrote to Dennisk <=-

Re: Re: Election
By: Dennisk to Dumas Walker on Wed Dec 09 2020 09:07 pm

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer of credibility now.

The allegations of fraud were never dismissed. This election has been looked over time and again. There have been hearings and investigations but never any real evidence of a stolen election.

Here in the message areas we can make any kind of claims we want and
argue day and night.

In a court if you make allegations you have to have proof and none has been provided.

Isn't the whole point of being an investigative journalist, to look into it?

That is my point, journalists weren't interested in digging into the claims. They were merely dismissed.

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Dumas Walker wrote to DENNISK <=-

They are trying to debunk that with the standard "no evidence of fraud" line but, IMHO, they could really shoot Trump down by actually looking into that instance and giving a brief explanation as to what the video shows.

It seems odd how easily some are willing to dismiss fraud, but have no
alternative explanation. Its like they've stopped trying to maintain a veneer
of credibility now.

Yes, that is it, like they've stopped trying.

It would not take much effort at all to give decent explanations for
all of the stuff that has made it on video. Doing so would completely kick the feet out from under the claims that Trump and his team are making. It seems like such an easy thing to do for anyone trying to be credible.

It is how I would handle it, unless I realized something really was
going on in the videos. Not being a politician, I would still handle
it that way even if it was bad news.

At the very least, you want want to act in a way which affirms people faith in the democratic process. If people believe that the democratic process doesn't work, then investigating and reporting an explanation for the claims of anomalies would restore faith. And that is IMPORTANT, because we consider free and fair elections something worthy to die and to kill for.

Even if the claims aren't justified, the 'ruling elite' have an obligation to assure the public, by means of evidence and careful debunking by providing better explanations of what is going on.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dennisk to Al on Thu Dec 10 2020 09:03 pm

Isn't the whole point of being an investigative journalist, to look into it?

Journalists will continue to journalize.

That is my point, journalists weren't interested in digging into the claims. They were merely dismissed.

Dismissed how? There have been so many hearings and court cases.

This whole election fraud thing is simply fake news. Donald Trump is having his digs at Mar-a-lago updated in advance of his arrival, even he knows the truth.
Hopefully this will be his last grift.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Some people are wise; others are otherwise.

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If they want to be transparent

Where is this lack of transparency?

and kick the legs out from under Trump, they would explain it better than
that. Dennis is correct. They don't want to provide an explanation.

There was an election, the votes were counted and Joe Biden was declared the w
ner of that election.

You may need to be tested for a reading comprehension issue. We were discussing a specific, RECENT video that surfaced which shows some election officials apparently being sent out of a room, and then the remaining ones pulling a bunch of ballot containers out from under a covered table and
running them through the machines.

I mentioned that it was a specific incident in the message you half-quoted above.

There was no explanation or transparency beyound the default "no evidence" line. Like I have said more than once, if they know it is not fraud, give
an actual explanation and kick Trump's legs out from under him.

"No evidence" is a BS answer that government folks give when they don't
want to explain something. It is also how conspiracy theories start.


* SLMR 2.1a * Psychoceramics: The study of crackpots.

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At the very least, you want want to act in a way which affirms people faith in >the democratic process. If people believe that the democratic process doesn't >work, then investigating and reporting an explanation for the claims of >anomalies would restore faith. And that is IMPORTANT, because we consider free
and fair elections something worthy to die and to kill for.

Exactly.

Even if the claims aren't justified, the 'ruling elite' have an obligation to >assure the public, by means of evidence and careful debunking by providing >better explanations of what is going on.

Some people, like the ones who dismiss everything they don't believe as a "conspiracy theory," are happy enough with the little box that shows up
after each election-related FB or YT post that tells them everything is OK.
I would prefer something a little more than a social media company's word for it.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Thu Dec 10 2020 01:19 pm

You may need to be tested for a reading comprehension issue.

Sorry you must have fallen behind again.

We were discussing a specific, RECENT video that surfaced which shows some election officials apparently being sent out of a room, and then the remaining ones pulling a bunch of ballot containers out from under a covered table and running them through the machines.

OK, good. You can keep taking about that if you want.

"No evidence" is a BS answer that government folks give when they don't want to explain something. It is also how conspiracy theories start.

No evidence is no evidence. It's made of the same BS as a conspiracy theory.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Acting without thinking is like shooting without aiming.

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No evidence is no evidence. It's made of the same BS as a conspiracy theory.

There is video evidence with no explanation given.

I guess next you will tell us all that the Fang Fang/Chinese spy issue is a conspiracy theory because Nancy P. says it was no big deal?

What about Hunter's China dealings? That was a conspiracy theory, too, until CNN started reporting earlier this week that he is indeed under
investigation, just like others reported he was before the election back in October.


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This whole election fraud thing is simply fake news. Donald Trump is having his
digs at Mar-a-lago updated in advance of his arrival, even he knows the truth. >Hopefully this will be his last grift.

WAIT, but I know that you believe that "fake news" doesn't exist, just like
the Easter Bunny, "Antifa," and "the Deep State."

"All news is news" and "Trump made up fake news" -- I remember that.


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Fri Dec 11 2020 11:36 am

There is video evidence with no explanation given.

That video, like so many supplied by the right has been debunked.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... *** ERROR *** Unable to insert witty tagline.

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Fri Dec 11 2020 11:41 am

WAIT, but I know that you believe

How do you know what I believe?

that "fake news" doesn't exist, just like the Easter Bunny, "Antifa," and "the Deep State."

Fake news is nothing new. Liars and cheats have existed since the beginning.

In spite of that the truth is available to you, if you care for truth.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... Fascinating, a totally parochial attitude. Spock, stardate 3219.8.

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There is video evidence with no explanation given.

That video, like so many supplied by the right has been debunked.

PUSU - show us where.


* SLMR 2.1a * Multitasking: When you get the weekend chore list.

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WAIT, but I know that you believe

How do you know what I believe?

Because you've told us before and I have a decent memory. Not great, but decent.

that "fake news" doesn't exist, just like the Easter Bunny, "Antifa," and
"the Deep State."

Fake news is nothing new. Liars and cheats have existed since the beginning.

So now it DOES exist. Hmmm....


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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Sat Dec 12 2020 09:25 am

Fake news is nothing new. Liars and cheats have existed since the
beginning.

So now it DOES exist. Hmmm....

It's always existed. Get it?

Ttyl :-),
Al

... I couldn't repair the brakes.. So I made your horn louder!

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Sat Dec 12 2020 10:30 am

That video, like so many supplied by the right has been debunked.

PUSU - show us where.

Ok, show me the link and we'll go from there.

Ttyl :-),
Al

... God is dead -Neitzsche Neitzsche is dead -God

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Re: Re: Election
By: Dumas Walker to AL on Sat Dec 12 2020 10:30 am

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Re: Re: Election
By: Andeddu to Vlk-451 on Sun Dec 06 2020 08:56 pm

Re: Re: Election
By: Vlk-451 to Andeddu on Sat Dec 05 2020 01:31 pm

A 'debate', as a noun, is understood as a formal discussion between people or groups of people that is regulated. Interestingly, debates are considered based on 'arguments', which are lines of reasoning, support or evidence about a subject. However, a debate has the feeling of a larger, longer or more formal discussion. A formal debate may even be judged by a person or a panel of people, with one side winning the debate by providing the best lines of reasoning or support for the issue. For example, She argued that people should have the right to decide about their own medical care at the debate.

A lot of the time certain posters here constitute a 'debate' as hurling insults at one another. I won't name names, but it's fairly evident who they are.

I'm honestly here to kick back and watch, munching on popcorn. I hope not to contribute to that too much, but holy fuck if some of it isn't funny as hell.

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